U.P. Power is dead

General board to discuss Upper Peninsula football.

Moderator: Moderator Group

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby amped0808 » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:06 am

Hambone wrote:amped0808....Pines already plays Wittenburg-Birnamwood in a non-conference game, most of the schools aren't that far off of HWY 29, plus you have the luxury of some freeway travel. Games would be closer/quicker than traveling to the Copper Country. The competition would be fierce, but still a better fit than the Great Northern.

Several years ago a football only conference was proposed for Hurley, Pines, Tomahawk, Chequamegon, Phillips, Rib Lake/Prentice, and a couple other schools in the region, but no one wanted to bite.

With the constant jacking around of conferences in Wisconsin, you can give me district play any day now. It's all centered around football anyway. Everyone makes the state tournament in other sports. Don't get me started on the jackasses at the WIAA, who jump through hoops when the urban schools bark, but could give a <b><i>****</i></b> less when the rural schools have an issue.


I get that Pines plays W-B in non-cons but I was thinking maybe the Marawood as a possible landing place for them since a few of those teams including fellow GNC foe Tomahawk plays in for football.
2013 Wissports HOF Inductee
Wissports Message Board Moderator
Once a Warrior always a Warrior
Twitter:https://twitter.com/Captain_Joe08
User avatar
amped0808
All UP
 
Posts: 707
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:40 am
Location: Milwaukee WI

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby HSFB Fan » Thu Nov 30, 2017 11:30 am

16 teams in one conference that does not allow outside of conference play?
That seems dumb.

Here are some enrollment numbers per the MHSAA (I don't think I missed someone in-between these...but I could have):

Marquette: 1052
Escanaba: 742
Sault: 718
Kingsford: 543
Gladstone: 493
Menominee: 481
Negaunee: 405
Houghton: 405
Calumet: 398

Here's the problem (as I see it).
Whoever made these decisions are making them "Just for them" instead of looking at the good for the entire U.P.

The WESTPAC (...and former MPC) has just hosed not only the GNC, but also the WI border schools (NP and Hurley) for the sake of what?
Must be nice to have 8 conference games and only have to find 1 that is in the other division of your conference....

Meanwhile Marquette and Kingsford lose over 200 years of tradition.
AND....the GNC might as well buy a few airplanes for the travel they will have to do.
HSFB Fan
UP Football Guru
 
Posts: 136
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:06 am

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby Hueby » Thu Nov 30, 2017 11:54 am

HSFB Fan wrote:16 teams in one conference that does not allow outside of conference play?
That seems dumb.

Here are some enrollment numbers per the MHSAA (I don't think I missed someone in-between these...but I could have):

Marquette: 1052
Escanaba: 742
Sault: 718
Kingsford: 543
Gladstone: 493
Menominee: 481
Negaunee: 405
Houghton: 405
Calumet: 398



Dropping in on my favorite site while here at work. If I could ask you (or anyone) could you list the new WestPAC teams by enrollment?

Or just split into 2 lists- one being the largest 8?
Am curious if their crossover games go by the standings, by enrollment or a prearranged rotation.

Just curious.

Thanks for anyone who can provide this. I gotta “move out and draw fire...”
Hueby
All UP
 
Posts: 2744
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 4:28 pm
Location: Green Bay, WI

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby scoopnscore » Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:20 pm

Marquette 1044
Escanaba 739
Soo 717
*Hancock 584
Kingsford 542
Gladstone 493
Menominee 479
*Gogebic 448
*Negaunee 405
*Houghton 404
*Calumet 396
*Lanse 351
*Westwood 342
*Manistique 342
*Ishpeming 311
*Iron Mountain 303
*Gwinn 272
*West Iron 245
*Norway 230
St. Ignace 212
Newberry 205
*Munising 200
*Bark River 197
*LLH 151

Above is the list of UP 11 Man football teams and their enrollments, including co-ops, for this past season. Asterisks next to all teams in the new Westpac. The Soo disappoints me so much with wimping out of the GNC to go play a bunch of tiny schools. I would have liked to see the Soo stay, Gladstone come back and Negaunee join the GNC. I never did hear if this was an all sports league or just football, anyone know for sure?
I haven't failed, I have just found 10,000 ways that won't work - Thomas Edison
User avatar
scoopnscore
All UP
 
Posts: 509
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:44 pm
Location: The Yoop

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby Hueby » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:18 pm

Awesome thank you scoopnscore for doing that!

I myself initially thought what amped0808 posted. I was figuring 3 divisions of 6 teams. Negaunee has had so much success against Gladstone and Marquette over the past 20 plus years I never saw this coming. I thought there would be more cross over between the smaller and medium size divisions.

Anyways, If it’s going to be pretty much a closed Conference for football I’m surprised they did what they did to Hurley and Pines. They could have kept them, had two 9 team divisions with a week 9 crossover game by standings or rotation whatever. So they would look like this:

Large- Hancock, Northland Pines, Gogebic, Negaunee, Houghton, Calumet, L’Anse,Westwood, Manistique

Small- Ishpeming, Iron Mountain, Gwinn, West Iron County, Norway, Munising, Bark River-Harris, Lake Linden- Hubbell, Hurley

The more I think about it, that was pretty cruel pushing out the WI schools like that.
Hueby
All UP
 
Posts: 2744
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 4:28 pm
Location: Green Bay, WI

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby Hueby » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:41 pm

As far as Sault Ste Marie, I don’t know if this is a good analogy- but if a student (team) is flunking/flunks school, do you:

a) Have him/her change teachers (coach)
b) Make them take studyhall (weightlift/camps/clinics)
c) Change schools (conference)
d) Hold them back a grade (drop down to easier competition)
e) Force them to take “honors classes” (to have them “step it up” to tougher competition )
f) Find if the problem is their home life (parents/culture)
g) A combination of the above
h) Figure they are a “lost cause”...go smoke some wacky tobacky in the big woods and live on welfare/ working people who pay taxes

Sorry I don’t have the answer! Hope you all got a chuckle!
Last edited by Hueby on Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Hueby
All UP
 
Posts: 2744
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 4:28 pm
Location: Green Bay, WI

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby Hambone » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:48 pm

The issue was the Wisconsin schools start and end a week earlier than Michigan schools. This was complicated by the fact that Northland Pines refused to play Hurley in the opening week of the Wisconsin season. The plan for this merger all along was Large/Small with protected crossover games based on geography and to preserve rivalries. Hurley was going to protect the Gogebic and Northland Pines games. It's over now...no going back.
User avatar
Hambone
Moderator
 
Posts: 3710
Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2002 2:51 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby Hueby » Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:10 pm

Hambone wrote:The issue was the Wisconsin schools start and end a week earlier than Michigan schools. This was complicated by the fact that Northland Pines refused to play Hurley in the opening week of the Wisconsin season. The plan for this merger all along was Large/Small with protected crossover games based on geography and to preserve rivalries. Hurley was going to protect the Gogebic and Northland Pines games. It's over now...no going back.


Ah that's why...thanks!
Hueby
All UP
 
Posts: 2744
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 4:28 pm
Location: Green Bay, WI

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby HSFB Fan » Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:25 pm

How does the WESTPAC now have basically all of the teams except the GNC teams and the far East?
"Two divisions....bla bla bla...whatever."

A 16 team conference? There are only 24 eleven man teams in the whole U.P.
Something seems fishy...
HSFB Fan
UP Football Guru
 
Posts: 136
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:06 am

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby upfootball » Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:44 pm

Oh it is....

Its for the larger WestPAC teams to avoid the GNC teams. Days of putting on your pants up here are long gone. They are scared to death of the GNC.
User avatar
upfootball
Founder
 
Posts: 10021
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2002 12:40 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby Hambone » Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:48 pm

It's even funnier now that I figured out that Manistique got into this arrangement through the back door and got placed into the small school division. This AD is a coward, he's running away from the MPC teams that regularly blew their doors off. Iron Mountain went into the large division.
User avatar
Hambone
Moderator
 
Posts: 3710
Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2002 2:51 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby upfootball » Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:54 pm

This is a total circus and its going to be a long offseason of calling them out. Every last one of them.
User avatar
upfootball
Founder
 
Posts: 10021
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2002 12:40 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby HSFB Fan » Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:55 pm

scoopnscore wrote:Marquette 1044
Escanaba 739
Soo 717
*Hancock 584
Kingsford 542
Gladstone 493
Menominee 479
*Gogebic 448
*Negaunee 405
*Houghton 404


I'm no mathematician...but that looks like it could be a pretty decent 9 game schedule.

Negaunee could save the Diamond Jubilee Trophy...
it's only been around longer than anyone on this earth has been alive...no big deal.
HSFB Fan
UP Football Guru
 
Posts: 136
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:06 am

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby HSFB Fan » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:01 pm

upfootball wrote:They are scared to death of the GNC.


Round 1 of D5....
Hancock proved they could play with Menominee in Round 1.
L'Anse and West Iron beat Hancock.

So....what are they scared of?
Be better.
HSFB Fan
UP Football Guru
 
Posts: 136
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:06 am

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby upfootball » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:01 pm

Negaunee has no interest in playing Marquette. That's the reason for the useless crossover games. To avoid any GNC teams for all of the larger teams in the WestPAC.
User avatar
upfootball
Founder
 
Posts: 10021
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2002 12:40 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby upfootball » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:03 pm

HSFB Fan wrote:Hancock proved they could play with Menominee in Round 1.
L'Anse and West Iron beat Hancock.

So....what are they scared of?
Be better.

Not sure. Ask the AD. They should want open weeks to schedule some challenges. No need for cross over to play a small school. I know for a fact Negaunee and Iron Mountain want nothing to do with Marquette and Kingsford.
User avatar
upfootball
Founder
 
Posts: 10021
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2002 12:40 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby upgridiron » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:04 pm

Here’s a scary thought. Let’s say that, for example, Gogebic or Hancock wins the WestPac conference with an undefeated season, and the winner of the GNC finishes the season with one loss. Would the WestPac champ have the legitimate claim to the Barber Trophy?
upgridiron
New to Board
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2017 3:46 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby upfootball » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:05 pm

upgridiron wrote:Here’s a scary thought. Let’s say that, for example, Gogebic or Hancock wins the WestPac conference with an undefeated season, and the winner of the GNC finishes the season with one loss. Would the WestPac champ have the legitimate claim to the Barber Trophy?

It would be a travesty to award anyone the Barber Trophy without earning it.
User avatar
upfootball
Founder
 
Posts: 10021
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2002 12:40 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby Hambone » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:07 pm

If Hancock can almost beat Menominee, why don't they just join the GNC? They are Claas B with their co-op?

L'Anse totally collapsed after the WIC and Hancock games, didn't make the playoffs.
User avatar
Hambone
Moderator
 
Posts: 3710
Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2002 2:51 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby HSFB Fan » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:10 pm

upfootball wrote:
upgridiron wrote:Here’s a scary thought. Let’s say that, for example, Gogebic or Hancock wins the WestPac conference with an undefeated season, and the winner of the GNC finishes the season with one loss. Would the WestPac champ have the legitimate claim to the Barber Trophy?

It would be a travesty to award anyone the Barber Trophy without earning it.


I have to believe the 1 loss GNC team would have more playoff points (How could they not?)
I don't know how the Barber Trophy gets awarded...is strength of schedule part of it?
HSFB Fan
UP Football Guru
 
Posts: 136
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:06 am

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby upgridiron » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:57 pm

HSFB Fan wrote:
upfootball wrote:
upgridiron wrote:Here’s a scary thought. Let’s say that, for example, Gogebic or Hancock wins the WestPac conference with an undefeated season, and the winner of the GNC finishes the season with one loss. Would the WestPac champ have the legitimate claim to the Barber Trophy?

It would be a travesty to award anyone the Barber Trophy without earning it.


I have to believe the 1 loss GNC team would have more playoff points (How could they not?)
I don't know how the Barber Trophy gets awarded...is strength of schedule part of it?



I believe the Barber Trophy is awarded by a vote of media sportswriters. With 16 communities represented by WestPAC teams, it’s almost like stuffing the ballot box with votes for your conference winner.
upgridiron
New to Board
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2017 3:46 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby upfootball » Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:44 am

upgridiron wrote:I believe the Barber Trophy is awarded by a vote of media sportswriters. With 16 communities represented by WestPAC teams, it’s almost like stuffing the ballot box with votes for your conference winner.

Exactly correct. Consider how many of these same media members had Gladstone as the best team in the UP last year for the first half of the season. It took a large sum of them exactly 5 months to forget Gladstone bolted from the GNC because they couldn't win. Then when some of us crucified them for it, they come up with "but I don't want to penalize the kids for the decision of the program". Apparently its perfectly fine to penalize the GNC kids for playing a schedule so tough that is makes Negaunee and Iron Mountain wet themselves right into the same move Gladstone made.
User avatar
upfootball
Founder
 
Posts: 10021
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2002 12:40 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby ftballfan » Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:13 am

upgridiron wrote:Here’s a scary thought. Let’s say that, for example, Gogebic or Hancock wins the WestPac conference with an undefeated season, and the winner of the GNC finishes the season with one loss. Would the WestPac champ have the legitimate claim to the Barber Trophy?


One of them would likely end up playing Kingsford or Menominee early in the playoffs
ftballfan
UP Football Guru
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:33 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby ftballfan » Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:15 am

Manistique should send a thank you letter to Northland Pines' AD
ftballfan
UP Football Guru
 
Posts: 420
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:33 pm

Re: U.P. Power is dead

Postby amped0808 » Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:36 am

ftballfan wrote:Manistique should send a thank you letter to Northland Pines' AD


Nice to know that Pines screws Hurley and themselves over and now both have to scramble to find games and conferences to be in.
2013 Wissports HOF Inductee
Wissports Message Board Moderator
Once a Warrior always a Warrior
Twitter:https://twitter.com/Captain_Joe08
User avatar
amped0808
All UP
 
Posts: 707
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:40 am
Location: Milwaukee WI

PreviousNext

Return to Upper Peninsula Board

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests